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  1. #1

    Gen III vs Gen IV

    What are the key contributors for the extra 100hp going from the gen 3 to 4? Roughly how much would I need to spend to get the same engine hp if I bought a Gen 3?

  2. #2
    VOA Mamba Member
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    EZ 2B Green's Avatar
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    There are many more improvements other than a horsepower increase between Gen III & Gen IV. Buy a Gen IV if it is within your budget!
    2008 SSG Roadster (Sold)
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  3. #3
    ViperGTS
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    Quote Originally Posted by EZ 2B Green View Post
    There are many more improvements other than a horsepower increase between Gen III & Gen IV. Buy a Gen IV if it is within your budget!
    +1

  4. #4
    VOA Mamba Member
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    Better synchros ( triple cone for first few gears instead of double), some changes to the frame, VVT and higher redline with the 8.4 ltr, change in the hood design, dual clutch setup, and more.

    As noted , if funds available , go with the Gen IV.

    PS - in my personal experience , my Gen IV got a lot better fuel mileage , even though I know this is not a real reason folks buy a Viper for.

    You have a PM
    Last edited by Bill Pemberton; 08-16-2018 at 09:41 AM.
    Retired and time to get back on track ---literally!

  5. #5
    I figured as much.....just taking a while to find s nice Gen IV at a good price....seem to be a bunch of Gen III available. Bill did you send me a PM...I do t see anything in my inbox. Try emailing me at s281E@yahoo.com.

  6. #6
    Two other big advantages of the Gen IV is the oiling distribution and the rear end. The Gen 3, when pulling lateral G's aka on a road course, will cause the oil to shift in the pan and starve the motor. Basically, the pick up system sucks for road course driving. The Gen IV's pickup system corrected this problem.

    The Gen IV rear end is much stronger than the Gen 3's.

  7. #7
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    What Color car are you looking for? I have a 2008 SSG for sale

  8. #8
    Lol.....99RT10.....you promised me pics like three weeks ago. Still waiting for them.

  9. #9
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    LOL, still stuck in Dayton, OH. I will PM you some if I can get a friend to run over to the shop.

  10. #10
    Enthusiast LateToTheParty's Avatar
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    I want to say they got rid of the exhaust crossover from the gen III to the gen IV so it's not as hot in the cab.

  11. #11
    99RT10 please do...thanks for the feedback guys. I guess I’ll go back to just looking for Gen 4 and 5 models. 99RT10 do you have any mods on the 08?

  12. #12
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    Bone stock for the most part. Just some exterior tweaks

    IMG952816.jpg

    IMG952817.jpg

  13. #13
    Lots of improvements for the GenIV over the III but their are some drawbacks that keep me in my GenIII to this day. First the VVT- as much as thats group to boost power in the upper ranges, there is some loss in low to mid range. Second - drive by wire. Sorry but there is nothing like a cable to a throttle body and if you want it all you get it all and not a computer telling you what you want. ALSO add to that the throttle lag time. Those two issues are evident in the gen5 also. I have additional power and upgrades in my Gen III to keep me happy with it but the 5s are very attractive with the looks and creature comforts. If it wasn't for the engine issues I would likely have made a move.

    The GenIIIs are huge bargains these days for everything you get. If you are willing to do some upgrades its hard to beat.

  14. #14
    Good points Mamba. I forgot to add that, if you want to go big power on a "budget", then Gen 3 is definitely the way to go. Pretty basic stuff to have a shop throw in a forged motor, some fuel, clutch, rear, and supercharger. You can hit 850whp in no time at all. Todd at A&C Performance is a great vendor and has a great shop. If you want big power, give him a call.

  15. #15
    No offense guys but did the two of you who posted last recently hit your heads hard? Possibly together? Lol joking guys!!!! In all honesty I used to say the same thing in regards to the drive by wire and lag time. Once you get a tune it is virtually unnoticeable. Additionally, yes the GenII had great low end torque, then the GenIII had moved the power up a tad in the rpm range and had good low end with great mid-range. The GenIV does sacrifice a bit of the low end and a tiny bit in the mid-range but it feels more than what it actually is because of how much more power ramps up in the GenIV at upper RPM's. Whereas the GenIII from the factory has a rev limiter at 6,050 (I believe) and typically makes peak HP around 5,600 to 5,800, my car now makes peak HP at 6,500rpm's!

    I came from a beautiful 06 GenIII coupe. I liked the car but I had to evaluate what it would take for it to compare to a GenIV. Once I factored in the articulating oil pick-up, transmission, rear differential (No the GenIV is not the most hardcore differential but it is leaps and bounds better than the GenIII, this was my biggest complaint of the GenIII!), I wanted to buy a GenIV hood, and from the factory you're already up 90HP. Once you add these cost up you start to realize the GenIII is not that big of a bargain. You are easily looking at over $10,000 to get to that point. On top of that all you need to do to a GenIV to make around 700HP at the flywheel is simple bolt-ons and tuning.

    06SRTCoupe, your interpretation of "basic stuff" (forged motor, supercharger, etc...) and "budget" is far beyond what most consider basic. I don't care who you are 850WHP does NOT come cheap!!!

  16. #16
    I did hit my head hard after seeing the amount of money I put in my GEnIII to improve it even past a gen IV. First heads cam by Dan at Viper Specialty. 613 to the wheels and all the goodies including Dans modified gen IV pan swingarm setup and gen IV heads and intake. I then upgraded everything else I mean everything else. Well aside from the transmission. Motons, OS Giken, gears, exhaust, fuel, brakes, wheels tires etc.

    My point is for the money and simplicity the gen III still provides great value and a great building block to upgrades.
    Be


    Quote Originally Posted by Stealth78 View Post
    No offense guys but did the two of you who posted last recently hit your heads hard? Possibly together? Lol joking guys!!!! In all honesty I used to say the same thing in regards to the drive by wire and lag time. Once you get a tune it is virtually unnoticeable. Additionally, yes the GenII had great low end torque, then the GenIII had moved the power up a tad in the rpm range and had good low end with great mid-range. The GenIV does sacrifice a bit of the low end and a tiny bit in the mid-range but it feels more than what it actually is because of how much more power ramps up in the GenIV at upper RPM's. Whereas the GenIII from the factory has a rev limiter at 6,050 (I believe) and typically makes peak HP around 5,600 to 5,800, my car now makes peak HP at 6,500rpm's!

    I came from a beautiful 06 GenIII coupe. I liked the car but I had to evaluate what it would take for it to compare to a GenIV. Once I factored in the articulating oil pick-up, transmission, rear differential (No the GenIV is not the most hardcore differential but it is leaps and bounds better than the GenIII, this was my biggest complaint of the GenIII!), I wanted to buy a GenIV hood, and from the factory you're already up 90HP. Once you add these cost up you start to realize the GenIII is not that big of a bargain. You are easily looking at over $10,000 to get to that point. On top of that all you need to do to a GenIV to make around 700HP at the flywheel is simple bolt-ons and tuning.

    06SRTCoupe, your interpretation of "basic stuff" (forged motor, supercharger, etc...) and "budget" is far beyond what most consider basic. I don't care who you are 850WHP does NOT come cheap!!!

  17. #17
    All in all, even after all the cost, especially it being over time, I am not much further in cost than a bolt on genIV but would take mine over one in a heart beat. I just wish mine was a coupe!

  18. #18
    The last part I forgot to mention is resale, if it occurs. Take a stock GenIV with the better trans, 90 more HP, better rear diff, better looking hood. Buy one that is immaculate for say $55,000 - $60,000 (coupe), keep it two years while keeping it beautiful and not racking up too much mileage then sell it, you could likely get $55,000 all day. Now take a stock GenIII (coupe), buy an immaculate one for $45,000. Put $10,000 - $15,000 into it, run it for two years under the same circumstances and you will likely have a resale value of what you paid, $45,000. Sorry I am OCD about this stuff, I work in finance and can't allow myself to break away from it.

  19. #19
    Back to the subject to get 100 extra horsepower out of a gen III you either need to find a Paxton car which they are out there and likely 3-5k over stock in price from what I have seen. To do it normally aspirated you will need head and likely cam, exhaust tune etc. Guessing entry level there is roughly 10-12k depending on how you go about it but I might be off.

  20. #20
    Agreed. Modifications don’t add a lot of value if any at all. All depends on what you are looking for and what you want to do with the car. Funny I’ve turned around every car I have had in the last 20 years within 3 years most sooner but the Viper I have had since 2005 and still giggle my ass off when I start it.


    Quote Originally Posted by Stealth78 View Post
    The last part I forgot to mention is resale, if it occurs. Take a stock GenIV with the better trans, 90 more HP, better rear diff, better looking hood. Buy one that is immaculate for say $55,000 - $60,000 (coupe), keep it two years while keeping it beautiful and not racking up too much mileage then sell it, you could likely get $55,000 all day. Now take a stock GenIII (coupe), buy an immaculate one for $45,000. Put $10,000 - $15,000 into it, run it for two years under the same circumstances and you will likely have a resale value of what you paid, $45,000. Sorry I am OCD about this stuff, I work in finance and can't allow myself to break away from it.

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  23. #23
    Well I will say it looks sweet! See you even went the route of a GenIV hood.

  24. #24
    VOA Member
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    RedTanRT/10's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by S281e View Post
    What are the key contributors for the extra 100hp going from the gen 3 to 4? Roughly how much would I need to spend to get the same engine hp if I bought a Gen 3?
    S281, lots of folks mentioned all the differences but no one posted the answer to your first question on why/how 90hp more, it's the heads.

    Simple answer to your second question, how much on a G3 to add 90hp? $10k with labor.
    Last edited by RedTanRT/10; 08-17-2018 at 06:12 PM.
    1994 Red/Tan RT/10, '99 red ACR- sold, '06 Red/Silver Coupe-RIP, '06 Red/Silver Coupe - Sold, '08 Red/Silver ACR-C sold, 2006 Comp Coupe C-92

  25. #25
    I may be wrong but wasn't there a bump in compression?

    - - - Updated - - -

    The intake probably didn't hurt either.


 
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