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  1. #1

    More Exclusive than an F Car or Lambo

    Found this on Fakebook. Does it look correct? I wonder which % are ACR cars?

    Really cool how all 5 generations were such low production volume over the course of 1/4 Century.
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  2. #2
    Enthusiast Hamrhead's Avatar
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    Does this mean my '15 will go up in value?



    I won't hold my breath...
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  3. #3
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    While i guess it helped “exclusivity “ it also ended production of our beloved viper. We have no car to root for on race day and are tracking a car that will be 3-4 yeArs out of production. I would have rather it been a good seller for FCA to give them a reason to continue R&D on the car and continue with a 6th generation. Farrari sold approximately 9200 cars in 2018 and Lamborghini sold 5700 cars in 2018. Those brands are still considered “exclusive “ . IMO, besides maybe the ACR and TA , all other trims Of the gen V will lose considerable value going forward as technology increases in the sports car world.

  4. #4
    There was data from the same source showing low production numbers for all of the other four generations too. Therefore, I don't think the exclusivity is unique to the fifth generation.

    It seems that government regulations killed the car more than low sales numbers. But I definitely remember somewhere in the middle of the generation's production when the plant temporarily closed. I bought two new gen V's, the first & last years of the generation and did my part. It seems unlikely that a gen 6 will be coming since we're now three production years out from the last year made in 2017.
    #6 of 11 Roanoke Special Edition ACR Extreme

  5. #5
    Enthusiast parabs's Avatar
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    Attached is Plum’s info that I saved at some point. I understand that Plum and ViperJeff have quite solid data on production numbers for Viper across the entire run.

    B098C772-C946-45A6-A748-F105AC6CFB2A.jpg
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  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by Policy Limits View Post
    There was data from the same source showing low production numbers for all of the other four generations too. Therefore, I don't think the exclusivity is unique to the fifth generation.

    It seems that government regulations killed the car more than low sales numbers. But I definitely remember somewhere in the middle of the generation's production when the plant temporarily closed. I bought two new gen V's, the first & last years of the generation and did my part. It seems unlikely that a gen 6 will be coming since we're now three production years out from the last year made in 2017.
    I can’t help but think FCA would have found a way to comply with federal regulations if it was making money with the Viper. They would have built more if the orders/demand was there. I purchased 3 gen. V’s 1 GTS and 2 ACR’s. Hopefully I’ll get to purchase a gen 6 one day

  7. #7
    Enthusiast Vipes's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by parabs View Post
    Attached is Plum’s info that I saved at some point. I understand that Plum and ViperJeff have quite solid data on production numbers for Viper across the entire run.

    B098C772-C946-45A6-A748-F105AC6CFB2A.jpg
    Woooah never seen chart before! Very cool to see the 2015-2017 TA 1.0/2.0 numbers match the count we have in the TA thread.
    Last edited by Vipes; 12-31-2019 at 12:17 AM.
    Venom Black Viper TA #15 ~ CM700

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    Had they built a Convertible or Targa Top they would have had a few exemptions till 2021....
    And Convertible sales typically are 2 for every hard top which would have helped production numbers , seems like the powers that be where not all in.......
    White Mamba ,

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    Quote Originally Posted by J TNT View Post
    Had they built a Convertible or Targa Top they would have had a few exemptions till 2021....
    And Convertible sales typically are 2 for every hard top which would have helped production numbers , seems like the powers that be where not all in.......
    Agreed, FCA brass overall did not support the Viper.

  10. #10
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    FCA Brass supported the Challenger

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    Quote Originally Posted by Fourtrax250r View Post
    Agreed, FCA brass overall did not support the Viper.
    Not since September 2014 and the MY15 release when Tim took over from Ralph, celebrated his appointment by axing the SRT brand and SRT Motorsports race team...and slashed the MSRP by $15,000 just to make sure previous buyers were paying attention. When the ACR was released for MY2016 he was quick to suddenly set as many track records as possible and then promote the shit out of it with advertisements featuring himself, all while he planned the axing of the car the following year. Tim has much to take credit for...thank you Tim.
    2014 SRT Black TA, stock with driver mod. Last of the 159 built. Thanks to Ralph and Team Viper for an incredible Viper!
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  12. #12
    Gen V Viper sales were dismal till the announcement of (1) the ACR(E) and it's various alterations and most importantly (2) the end of production. That is what spurred the increased sales in the last two years. They were limping along at 50 a month before that.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by ViperJon View Post
    Gen V Viper sales were dismal till the announcement of (1) the ACR(E) and it's various alterations and most importantly (2) the end of production. That is what spurred the increased sales in the last two years. They were limping along at 50 a month before that.
    Classic car company move of getting it right just in time to kill it!
    Want a mod that makes your car faster? Fix the nut behind the wheel!

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    Quote Originally Posted by parabs View Post
    Attached is Plum’s info that I saved at some point. I understand that Plum and ViperJeff have quite solid data on production numbers for Viper across the entire run.

    B098C772-C946-45A6-A748-F105AC6CFB2A.jpg
    Did they ever finish the color breakdown for 2017 on the registry?
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    Quote Originally Posted by parabs View Post
    Attached is Plum’s info that I saved at some point. I understand that Plum and ViperJeff have quite solid data on production numbers for Viper across the entire run.

    B098C772-C946-45A6-A748-F105AC6CFB2A.jpg
    WOW ! If the chart is right, my 2016 GTC / TA 2.0 is really a 1 of 1 , along with a 2017 TA 2.0 and TA 1.0
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  16. #16
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    The decision to not invest in the platform further was made by the brass in 2015. FMVSS 226 was the stake through the heart. Tim's big head was just a speed bump. In 2016 & 2017 they could not keep up with demand mainly with the specialty suppliers. Se la vie!
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    There are lots of "exclusive" cars, like the Plymouth Prowler, Pontiac Aztec, etc. But you see the point that I'm making -- if you're measuring exclusivity by production numbers, you may be confusing automotive exotica (highly desirable) with automotive shitopia (not desirable).

    Lucky for us, I think the Gen V is on the right side of this coin. Judging from reviews, social media posts, and firsthand experience, the cars are very highly respected and appreciated by all ages. The cars have a great presence about them and are future classics for sure.

    As for the numbers, it is awesome (in both a good and bad way) to see how few were built. It all but guarantees future price appreciation, but also reveals the galactic incompetence of FCA. How such a great car could be so entirely dismissed by such a large and consumptive global sports car market is astounding. So many brands saw resurgences in sports car sales during the Gen V years, yet FCA entirely missed it. If the car were crap, that would be one thing, but it was not.

    It should have kept racing (it won the GTLM Championship in 2014), it should have kept going to LeMans, it should have been battling it out with Team Corvette C7R and then FordGT (in '17/'18). The ACR/E should have been a genuine wide-body car like the racer, should have been an H/C car, and should have sold for $200k+, built to order. If nobody wanted one, then no big deal as they would all be built on the same line -- you just continue to build GTS, TA, and ACR for the masses.

    But I think FCA would have sold some -- and might have had to limit the number available (and give first dibs to prior owners). There are plenty of enthusiasts (and posers) that would have spent almost any amount of $$$ to have the wildest looking car on the road. And at the very least, FCA would have had a genuine halo car at a genuine halo price and the cars would have generated huge brand awareness and goodwill.

    Just like whenever a new FGT rolls into the local C&C, could you imagine a wide body GT3R with H/C rolling in, with OEM level interior finishes, etc? What???? That would have been sick!!!
    Last edited by Scott_in_fl; 12-30-2019 at 05:11 PM.

  18. #18
    Its just sad to me how it all ended. The Viper program had more diehard car guys involved with it than any other current day program imo. The final days before it died you could hear and feel the frustration and disappointment in Ralphs posts on IG.

    They really should have offered a convertible like other said, not my cup of tea but the lines do flow really well on the medusa ones. Some people say they should have added an auto for sales alone, and honestly I agree.

    It had traction control now and way more luxury than previous years so if for nothing else than more sales to keep the thing alive I wish they would have.. thoughts? I heard once they didn't cause it "wouldn't fit" but that's false with all the Gm auto ones that have been swapped after. The death of this program (again) was just so damn sad and such a wasted opportunity, totally agree with they should have kept the race program, couldn't believe they killed it so soon.

  19. #19
    I agree. G5 is by far the best Viper. They needed to add a Vert and an 8sp Auto and they would not have been able to make enough of them.

    The handling and the way the rear is just planted makes it so F-ING good. It's the first viper I can throttle steer on the street without fear of death. I can dance with this car, not wrestle it. Light clutch and easy throws makes it an excellent daily driver. Seats could use lumbar support and a shorter seat bottom but other than that excellent car. Oh and this GTS interior is perfect 👌

  20. #20
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    The 8 speed auto was the key to keep moving forward ...

    today's young guys with $$$ do NOT want to row gears ...

  21. #21
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    If I remember correctly the 8 speed auto would not fit in the existing frame and would require a new and federally approved new frame at a substantial cost ........
    Had SRT Engineers known that was the end game, they could have made provisions for it when the frame was originally designed....
    White Mamba ,

  22. #22
    The 8sp would fit as a transaxle. It would also push more weight over the rear tires making it something like 45f/55r in weight distribution. The car would Launch like a AWD car with the right suspension setup. The massive tires would have more grip with a bit more weight on them. Could you imagine the grip with tires that actually take up all available room back there. From my own measurements a 385 wide tire would fit without going widebody.

    315's up front and 385's rear would be absolute bonkers in mechanical grip.
    Last edited by Whiskey; 01-01-2020 at 11:23 AM.

  23. #23
    I thought it was funny how at the start of the generation the Viper purists were mostly naysayers. Especially since to me the car looked like a modern featured retro car like a gen II on steroids. Their business team failed from marketing to quality control to production. They finally got it right towards the end. It started with the TA and was reinforced by the ACR Extreme. the 1 of 1 program went well too. It was from lessons learned of customers with good money deposits down waiting while they built other cars that no one ordered nor wanted. It's a niche clientele that doesnt just want a sportscar. We want our names on dash plaques, numbered editions and a car that does 7:01 at the Ring with rear wheel drive and manual transmission and all without manufacturer support.

    At least it went out on top!
    #6 of 11 Roanoke Special Edition ACR Extreme

  24. #24
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    I don't know if you guys consider 35 young, but I do enjoy rowing the gears of my Viper.
    I don't enjoy rowing the gears of a 1.4L Diesel Turbo Rental in Germany.

    31,947 Vipers total in all years of production makes for a special car. That's about how many Corvettes are built in an individual year. I think the Ferrari 458 was selling 5,000 units a year. Lower numbers is great to make a car special but it's a double edged sword, because low sales numbers doesn't make a car manufacturer money.

    I love the Viper because it held true to it's heritage, it's truly American and didn't compromise. At the same time it's probably dead because it didn't compromise. Automatic. Convertible. Electronic everything. Luxury this and that.

    Some things exist for a good time, not a long time. We're the lucky few.
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  25. #25
    Even though it has a manual transmission there's really a lot of modern features in the car.
    #6 of 11 Roanoke Special Edition ACR Extreme


 
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