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  1. #1

    Post Timing chain cover sealing

    Two questions I'd like some feedback/ confirmation on.

    First - I've got some pitting on the block from coolant corrosion. Picture below for reference. I block sanded the mating surface smoothing most of it out but didn't want to get to aggressive. You think the cometic gasket will seal ok or do I need to use some rtv too?

    Second - I covered the hole with towels to keep junk out but I did have to use a wire wheel and sand paper to smooth things out. You think rinsing the timing chain area with a quart or two of oil and letting it drain out the oil pan would be a good/safe way to clean any left over debris? I hit it with my shop vac before the picture.

    20210912_151431.jpg

  2. #2
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    1) A very thin layer of blue RTV won't hurt anything. Be sure and put a dab of it at the bottom corners where the pan meets the timing cover regardless.

    2) Dunk it in the neighbor's swimming pool and follow up with a heat lamp. You can't be too sure. Leave a twelve'r of natty light on the patio table with a thank you card.
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  3. #3
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    You'll notice the flat flange on the crank snout...that is where the oil pump mates with the crank. Make sure when you reinstall the timing cover that the corresponding oil pump gear aligns with that mating surface. Other than that, it looks like you did a mighty fine job!!!

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    Not sure if its the same product But I use Hylomar Blue Gasket joining compound, I use my finger to put a smear of it evenly on the metal surfaces either side of the gasket, for the bottom corners of the timing cover where it joins the oil pan I use Black RTV.

  5. #5
    Enthusiast GTS Dean's Avatar
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    Is that the stock sump cover for the engine's oil pan? It looks different than mine - appears raised in the center.
    96 GTS. Viper Days Modified Class. Fresh motor 10-2020!

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by GTS Dean View Post
    Is that the stock sump cover for the engine's oil pan? It looks different than mine - appears raised in the center.
    As far as I'm aware it's stock.

  7. #7
    Enthusiast My98RT10's Avatar
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    It does look different to my '98 cover which is not raised in the center....

    I did the whole thing with the oil pan removed as recommended by the Wizard at the time. If I remember correctly, reason was that it is easier to put the TC cover back on. I know that the factory manual does not require to remove the pan but I thought it is a good move to take advice from a man who did this job a hundred times and more

    Another advice was to install the crankshaft seal after the TC cover has been put back on. Otherwise there is a chance to twist or compromise the seal during installation of the cover...

  8. #8
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    Depending on mileage, i'd replace the chain since you're in there already. I just did this on mine with a Cloyes chain. Pull the cam gear and then clean off the gear and bolt and chain with brake cleaner, and then use some locktite on the cam bolt when re-installing and torquing. Pour a little oil on the chain itself or assembly lube.

    I'd probably pull the pan and make sure its fully cleaned out too just in case. You're already this deep in the engine, might as well do it right. Also, use a product called "The Right Stuff" from permatex (black). It beats the pants off of just about all RTV out there and i've used nothing else since i discovered it 10+ years ago. use gloves with this stuff because it gets messy. You wont have any leaks if you use this stuff and apply it properly. It will take up any extra clearance you have caused by any nics or gouges or scuffs on the sealing surface without problem. Best way to apply it is to just put a little on the gasket and smear it in on the gasket between your thumb and index finger so it has a thin layer all around the gasket on both sides, and then stick it to the block or cover. This also makes it easier to remove in the future instead of scraping stuck paper gasket off the block later on down the road if you have to remove the cover again.

    https://www.permatex.com/products/ga.../?locale=en_us
    Last edited by Lunchbox; 4 Weeks Ago at 08:24 AM.

  9. #9
    So if you are going back with the Cometic gaskets, and are pretty happy with the mating surfaces, I wouldn't bother with any RTV.

    I did this 2 years ago with Cometic and didn't need any RTV on any of them.

    I did just about all the front gaskets you can think of: timing cover, water pump, thermostat, oil filter adapter, intake.

    Those gaskets are fantastic about sealing.

    My98RT10 is right, put the crank seal on after the cover is put back on, I also went with an ARP crank bolt. When I went to take it out it the original was loose!.
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  10. #10
    Enthusiast GTS Dean's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 98RedGTS View Post
    As far as I'm aware it's stock.
    Studying more closely, I may be looking at the windage tray with an extended section spot welded to the upper part.
    96 GTS. Viper Days Modified Class. Fresh motor 10-2020!

  11. #11
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    I use brake parts cleaner to clean everything. I would replace the timing chain, make sure you use lock tite on the cam bolt and torque it.
    I would replace the old style oil pan gasket with the newer aluminum type or Cometic. Might be a good time to replace the water pump, radiator
    hoses, belt, tensioner and idler pulley. You might consider upgrading to a SFI harmonic balancer as well.

    One note, always install the front timing cover crankshaft oil seal once the cover is installed, not before.
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  12. #12
    Appreciate all the advice from everyone. I guess I'll pull the oil pan while I'm in here. The manual didn't mention it so I hadn't planned on it but I do want to do things right. The car only has 13K miles on it. Do ya'll still think I need to do the timing chain? I've never dug THAT deep into an engine before and I assume it's simple to do but I really don't want to screw something up as I can't afford a new engine if I do screw something up, like get it out of time.

    Here is everything I've got going back in already:
    - I literally just replaced all hoses on the car with OEM rubber hoses 500 miles ago so am planning to reuse them all. I've removed them all and cleaned them thoroughly as I'm changing from coolants from green to the MOPAR HOAT as suggested by Dan L when I bought my gaskets.
    - Removed my leaking HOWE radiator and put in my repaired X2.
    - Still waiting on my waterpump to be rebuilt. Sent it in first of June and is the last part I need to finish this job. Every time I talk to the rebuilder it's "almost ready". I'd put my Cardone unit back on but when I took it off it shows clear and obvious signs of failure already as their is a distinct staining at the weep hole. That lasted 500 miles which is RIDICULOUS. I was going to buy an old stock OEM but at nearly $400 and no warranty I decided on a professional rebuild.
    - New OEM Gen 3 thermostat. Replaces my Roe unit that looks like it wasn't opening all the way. Hopefully this will fix my cooling issues.
    - All new cometic gaskets for timing chain cover, oil filter adapter, water pump, thermostat housing, and intake manifold. Looks like I'll need to order the oil pan now too. I got OEM front crank seal and will be putting it on after the cover is on.
    - New belt, belt tensioner and idler pulley
    - ARP Harmonic balancer bolt
    - Refinished all pulleys (minus the belt riding surface)
    - I had two bolt holes that weren't very good (previously stripped and retapped from coolant corrosion) so I bought the time sert kits needed for the threads and put time serts in those two locations.
    - Shoot, I've even gone all stupid and cleaned all the bolts that I've taken off. Tumbled for 2 days and all threads chased. I want this car to be perfect so trying to do everything to the best of my ability.

    Picture of my parts below. Yes, I labeled the bolts as I tend to forget which goes where sometimes. They look to be obvious but didn't want to risk things.

    1.jpg2.jpg3.jpg

  13. #13
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    My car has over 1001,000 miles on it and I have not changed the timing chain, quite frankly everything there looks perfect. I would pull the oil pan, wash it all out using brake cleaner, the small screws on the oil pan cover plate can come loose, so its worth checking them. now it you want to do a sensible upgrade while there, I would recommend the oil pan baffle plates, this reduces oil starvation under braking and acceleration and can be found on the IPSCO Viper parts website.

    Get yourself the factory service manual and stick to the torque figures recommended.

  14. #14
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    Check the service manual and check the chain slack to determine. Tbh, if the car was driven very hard but has low miles on it, the chain can have some wear or stretch. The slack test will tell you whats what. Overall, you cant screw up timing the engine if you follow the manual. Just match the marks between crank and cam gear and then rotate it twice once the chain is back on i believe to make sure it all lines back up and you're set. I'd say, since you're in there, its worth atleast testing it and making sure you checked everything so you don't have to come back in and take it apart again, however that is just my mentality when it comes to this stuff.

    As for cleaning the bolts, ive done the same thing and i'm at a pretty similar stage you are with the exception that my cylinder heads are off. Im simply waiting on gaskets at this point and a water pump to show up so i can get this show on the road!

    If it comes to it and you want some help changing the chain and timing it, let me know. Id be happy to help out seeing as i just did mine.
    Last edited by Lunchbox; 4 Weeks Ago at 05:17 PM.


 

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